“If George Was Still Alive…”

By Moshe Mandel On July 4, 2011 · 10 Comments · In General Musings

In last night’s Open Thread, Steve asked us to complete the following sentence: “If George was still alive….” My response was as follows:

“….he’d probably wonder why people forgot that he was basically all bark and no bite once he came back from suspension, and would be baffled by the fact that people throw around “if George was alive, he’d do X” as if he would actually have done X.”

Now, George did scare off a number of employees once he returned from his ban from baseball. His constant meddling and browbeating caused some of Joe Torre’s coaches to quit out of frustration, and created a pressure-packed and uncomfortable management situation. That said, the days of him ordering a player to be sent to AAA or just firing managers due to “in the moment” quibbles had largely passed by 1996, and most of the anecdotes that people intend to reference when they pull the “If George was still alive” canard out of the bag occurred decades ago. The fact of the matter is that if George was still alive today, Brian Cashman would likely still be the GM, Joe Girardi would be the manager, and Ramiro Pena would not have been cut immediately after yesterday’s debacle. I suspect that not much at all would be different.

If George was still alive, today would be his birthday. Instead of remembering him for his flaws and the insane antics of the 80′s, let’s celebrate his birthday and appreciate the fact that he built the franchise into a financial powerhouse that can afford to field a fantastic team every season. He also left the team in the hands of people who, for all their faults, want to win and are willing to spend to do so.

If George was still alive, I’d shake his hand, wish him a Happy Birthday, and thank him for a job well done.

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10 Responses to “If George Was Still Alive…”

  1. says:
    July 4, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    If George were still alive, and in his prime, he’d have the best Twitter account on the planet.

    [Reply]

  2. Phil C says:
    July 4, 2011 at 3:31 pm

    GMS not only restored the Yankees to greatness, he gave us some incredible entertainment, especially when coupled with Billy Martin. Happy Birthday GMS!

    [Reply]

  3. Steve S. says:
    July 4, 2011 at 4:18 pm

    Well said Mo, when I remind people of his buffoonery during the 1980s its an attempt to balance off some of the lionization, selective memory and revisionist history that has gone on since his death. As you noted, he had more than his share of accomplishments, not the least of which was setting the tone for a perrenial championship organization. One which would continue to perform even after he was gone, which may be the greatest tribute of all. But I have to note that on a day to day basis, when it came to baseball ops, the best thing he ever did was sign checks, hold people accountable and most importantly, learned to leave his baseball people alone. The business success followed the on field success, and in that area he was meddling and clueless.

    [Reply]

    Duh, Innings! Reply:
    July 4th, 2011 at 5:15 pm

    George meddled the most 1986-90, but the Yankees still produced solid teams in 1986-88. After he returned, he chilled out considerably. He made the right call on Gooden and Strawberry for 1996. Both in their small ways helped the Yankees win it all for the first time since 1978. George wanted Joe Torre when no one else in the organization, not even Gene Michael, did. That didn’t turn out too badly. If people are gonna say George was meddlesome, they have to say sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn’t and the times it did work out far outshined the times it didn’t. Did any of you in your heart of hearts truly believe Buck Showalter would’ve managed the Yankees to four World Series titles and two AL pennants? I don’t. Maybe one.

    The revisionist history of the 1980s Yankees is they sucked when in fact they were quite good save 1982 and 1989, just not good enough to make the postseason after 1981, but baseball was wayyy more competitive than it is now. I could be mistaken but the Yankees won the most games and drew the most fans of any MLB team in the ’80s. They had a division-winning team in 1980, a pennant-winning team in 1981 (albeit in a strike-shortened season, but still a pennant-winner), a bad team in 1982, a very good team in 1983, a good in 1984, a great team in 1985, a very good team in 1986 who would’ve won the division had prime Roger Clemens not been AL MVP and Cy Young Award 24-4 stupendous, a very good team in 1987 (89-win fourth place team = the best division in MLB that year), a decent team in 1988, and one bad one in 1989.

    Looking back at the ’80s the Yankees just lacked a #2 behind Guidry. I think they could’ve won the AL East at least twice 1983-87 if they had a #2 year in and year out.

    George’s meddlesome-ness is overblown because the Yankees had exactly one bonafide shit seasons while he was in MLB: 1990. 1982 was a bump in the road and 1989 was just the team’s core got old. His only real fuckup in terms of ordering trades was Jay Buhner for Ken Phelps, but the Yankees’ problem was pitching way more than hitting. He barked about Pettitte for Justin Thompson but that could’ve been a wild rumor.

    Re: 1989-92 people gotta realize the Yankees had no chance against the elite teams of the time and if you look at who they traded away, would any of them have really helped them win it all? Jose Rijo was somewhat inconsequential. He happened to land on the Reds and no one expected him to make the As his World Series bitch. Doug Drabek would’ve been the Yankees ace after Guidry but who would’ve backed him up besides Scott Sanderson? Al Leiter didn’t get it in gear as a starter until the early-mid ’90s. Jay Buhner wouldn’t have helped Seattle win the AL West in ’95 without the help of Ken Griffey Jr., Randy Johnson, and a young A-Rod, even Norm Charlton, too et.al. Winfield was by all rights done after 1988 missing all of 1989 but he rebounded enough to collect over 3000 hits and become a first-ballot Hall Of Famer.

    George’s one brain-fart after the ’80s was wanting to trade Bernie Williams for Darren Lewis which would’ve been the absolute worst trade in Yankees history. Thankfully Gene Micheal talked him out of it – WHEW! Then again who the hell really knows to what extent that rumor/story is true. Maybe George mentioned it as a possibility and whoever in the media blew it out of proportion.

    His one true fuckup was Howard Spira but hey, MLB let him back into baseball, so no more talk about that.

    Don’t tell me the ’80s Yankees were bad. The 1982 and 1989 Yankees were bad, every other team was good to great depending on the year. Again, they lacked a #2 behind Guidry and just couldn’t overcome that. The ’85 team would’ve been the wildcard had the wildcard been instituted that year or before it. The ’80s Yankees were Good But Not Good Enough. That’s it. Lots of clubhouse strife, yeah, but they managed to field 8 good or better teams out of 10.

    [Reply]

    Steve S. Reply:
    July 4th, 2011 at 5:32 pm

    Steve Trout.

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    Duh, Innings! Reply:
    July 4th, 2011 at 5:53 pm

    …negated by Joe Torre.

    Steve Trout was not the reason why the 1987 Yankees didn’t make the postseason.

    For one, the 1987 Yankees were in the toughest division in baseball, finishing 89-73.

    Second and the primary reason was the Yankees 1-2 Guidry-Rasmussen did not pitch full seasons. Guidry made only 17 starts, Rasmussen 25. Now you could argue 25 from Rasmussen was a full season, but back then, a starter could’ve easily made as many as 35 starts. I’d say the Yankees lost at least 16 starts from Guidry and 8 starts from Rasmussen if you want to say both could’ve started 33 games each.

    Those 24 starts lost plus 2 were made by Trout (9), Hudson (11), and Tewksbury (6). All four did not produce the performances healthy all year Guidry and Rasmussen would’ve produced. Replace Gullickson’s 8 starts with Niekro’s 8 and it still wasn’t good enough.

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    Duh, Innings! Reply:
    July 4th, 2011 at 6:05 pm

    I meant those three starters didn’t pitch anywhere close as I miscalcuated.

    The 1987 Yankees basically lost 2/3rds of a season’s worth of starts from their 1-2. They had a patchwork parade of starters after Guidry, Rasmussen, John, and Rhoden. Leiter, Tewksbury, Arnsberg, Niekro, Gullickson, Hudson, Trout, Shirley, Allen, Bordi. Trout was merely one of them and the best by past recent record. 127 starts in 4 seasons 1983-86 plus 25 in ’87 with the Cubs. It wasn’t an unreasonable trade considering the Yankees needed innings.

    Let me know if the 2011 Yankees make the postseason if Sabathia and Colon or Burnett (whoever you consider the #2) are out for the season after their next starts. You’d be seeing a rotation of Colon or Burnett as the ace/Garcia as the #2, Nova as the #3, Hughes as the #4 (they could switch places fuck it), and a parade of AAA starters and castoffs like Carlos Silva cuz you’re nuts if you think any team out there is trading a #3 or better to the Yankees without wanting Hughes, anytwo from Betances, Banuelos, and Montero, and yeah, they can ask for that ransom from the Yankees.

    Oh yeah, the ’87 Yankees also had weak hitters at C, SS, and DH. Claudell Washington was Rickey Henderson’s replacement when Rickey fell to injury and was out for someone and (Claudell) posted a .336 OBP with nowhere close the SB Rickey would’ve provided. Teams sighed with relief when Claudell got on base cuz it wasn’t Rickey.

    [Reply]

  4. Duh, Innings! says:
    July 4, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    If George were still alive he’d want Nova an 8-4, 4.12 ERA starter to remain in the rotation, not be replaced by an 0-1, 13.94 ERA starter because this starter MIGHT be an ace in 2013 or 2014 or whatever year Yankee Overanalysts think he will be based on one very good half-season Hughes has produced in four seasons as a starter. That doesn’t mean Nova would remain in the rotation as Cashman could always talk George out of it, but I could see George saying “don’t fix what ain’t broke”.

    George would probably at least bark about wanting a veteran infielder a la Luis Sojo to back up Cano, A-Rod, and Jeter since Pena can’t seem to field routine grounders in what little playing time he gets and Nunez was just as bad before he got the call to hold down SS for Jeter. Yesterday’s game was a horrible loss not cuz Rivera blew the save, but because it was lost on the horrible defense by a backup infielder who can’t hit or make routine plays. At least with Nunez you could argue he should be playing every day and that’s why he blows at SS. Pena? When has this guy ever been projected to be an everyday player? He has no excuse to field poorly.

    [Reply]

    Moshe Mandel Reply:
    July 4th, 2011 at 5:02 pm

    I think George would want the guy nicknamed the “Phranchise” in the rotation, because we all know he loved a good nickname. I could see George saying, “I really like a good nickname. Gee, Phil Phranchise. Swell.”

    [Reply]

    Duh, Innings! Reply:
    July 4th, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    Nah. He would’ve wanted the guy nicknamed “Super Nova” :)

    Now you’re saying Phil Hughes is the franchise haha. He ain’t.

    [Reply]

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